“This is a war between democracy and dictatorship, between light and darkness, and I want light”: why a historian has to take up arms

– Dr. Zhaloba, please tell us about your professional work before the war.

– I consider teaching to be my main focus. I love working with students, and I am deeply convinced that the kind of education and values we give to the younger generation will determine the kind of old age we will have. I have lived in Austria for a year, and after that, I kept in touch with my foreign colleagues and realized that children [students — O.O.] need to see that there is another life, they need to feel this life. For example, in 2003, we traveled with my students through Frankfurt, Berlin, Potsdam, Bonn, Munich, and Dresden. After that, I took my students to Austria every year to develop professional communication and build professional connections.

In 2001, when I returned to teaching at the University of Chernivtsi after Austria and my doctoral studies, I started working at the Department of International Relations, which had just been launched. And then in 2004, I moved to Kyiv. For the first three years, I worked at Kyiv International University, then I worked at the Institute of International Relations at the National Aviation University, from 2012 to 2017 I was the department chair at the Diplomatic Academy, and from 2017 to 2021 I worked at Borys Hrinchenko Kyiv University, where I’m still a part-time lecturer.

I have also been in touch with my colleagues at the International Association for the History of Railways for a very long time. In 2004, I came to the first conference held in Austria on the occasion of the 150th anniversary of the Semmering Railway, the world’s first mountain railway. At some point, I joined the association and started participating in various conferences, and later they appointed me to the board. For a long time, I was the only historian from all of Eastern Europe who was represented in this association. Now there are people from Hungary, Belarus, and Romania. While working at the Diplomatic Academy, I joined the Scientific Society of History, Diplomacy, and International Relations.

After 2014, it became clear to me that in addition to teaching, social activities are also important. Anyone who remained active after the Maidan¹ should also be involved in social activities, so I joined the Pan-Europian Union². In February 2017, at the Diplomatic Academy, we announced that we were starting our work. I focused on working with young people. And it turned out that we are one of the most active organizations in the International Pan-European Movement today.

– So your work involved very multifaceted activities?

– Yes, it was important to me in terms of the practical benefits it could bring to Ukraine. And especially for the young people who will come after us. I have always emphasized that for me the idea of Pan-Europe is not only about Ukraine’s accession to the European Union, as it is often vulgarized. No, for me, it is about the basic principles that made Europe successful in its day, and which it is losing to a large extent now. We must work under the assumption that in addition to rights, we have responsibilities. We must clearly understand that what we have is a consequence of our work, our actions and deeds have led to this situation. We have to analyze what was done wrong to fix the situation and what needs to be done to make it better.

“This war is existential for us, but it is also existential for Russia”

– So you believe that the actions and choices made in the past have led to the current situation? In this case, do you think it was possible to prevent this war?

– Under the current regime in Russia, we could have prevented this war only if we had simply surrendered and would not have been successful. I constantly emphasize that this war is existential for us, but it is also existential for Russia, for the Russians as a nation, and for the form of statehood that they have today. For me, the Russian Federation is the last colonial empire. Historical experience shows that all colonial powers have to go. Russians as a nation have to make a choice: are they Asians or Europeans? They cannot fathom a prosperous Ukraine. Ukraine’s prosperity means the death of their regime. Russians are absolutely fine with Germany being prosperous, with the United States of America being prosperous: “Well, they are Germans, they are Americans,” but “that the khakhly are prosperous” is a brain buster for them. They have a question: if the “khakhly” are prosperous with the resources they have, and the Russians with the entire periodic table are still freezing, then, accordingly, what is Putin doing? Therefore, for me, this war was inevitable. I have always believed that we need to have a strong army, that Russia will attack, we will have to fight, and if we win, Russia will start to crumble, creating a zone of instability. Only in the case of destructive processes in Russia itself could a major war be averted, but we would still have to protect our borders from pockets of instability. In fact, we are dealing with the historical pattern of a clash between two different value systems — the Ukrainian model, which positions itself as a Western European model, and the Russian model with its Orthodoxy and Eastern European messianism.

– Dr. Zhaloba, did you know the invasion was imminent? Did you prepare in advance?

– On February 23, I had a lecture at 10.00 a.m. I told my students that the war would begin tomorrow or the day after… At first, I thought that the Russians would attack on the 23rd, given their symbolism.

That’s why I made sure my car tank was full, and prepared everything in advance. We gathered all the documents, and all the money, in one place. I packed an emergency backpack. I would walk every morning in the park to get fit, so I was getting ready. I went to classes organized by the National Corps³. My daughters and I went there to train.

My military background is in artillery, I graduated from the military department of Chernivtsi University. In 1985, I was promoted to officer, and that was the last time I was at the range, firing a howitzer. The last time I fired an assault rifle, 6 shots, was in 1985. In 1987, back in Soviet times, there were short courses, and I was near a howitzer once again. After that, I saw howitzers only on monuments.

I had artillery training, but I started infantry training. I found these classes very interesting. First of all, it was important to feel the mood of the people, the unity. When you sit at home, you have a bad feeling that you cannot influence anything, you feel anxious. My children had the same feeling, so we joined the training. The training in tactical medicine was very good. A very important point: the Azov guys⁴ who taught us explained everything very well, it was clear that they were professionals with extensive combat experience. We looked very funny in their eyes, I understand that, but there was never a hint of arrogance or ridicule on their part. It gave us a boost, confidence that we had someone to lean on, guys to fight with, and, accordingly, that people were ready.

So I was preparing, I was restoring my old skills and acquiring new ones in these classes. My personal things were packed, the plan was in place, the car was fueled, and the diesel canister was full. The plan was as follows: as soon as we hear the first shots, I take my two daughters and drive to Chernivtsi, where our grandmothers are, and then I come back. My wife is a doctor, an obstetrician-gynecologist, and she knew that she would stay with her patients anyway. And as it happened, on the morning of February 24, my wife was heading to the clinic for a 24-hour shift. It was about 5 o’clock in the morning when the first explosions began, the war started… After I ran to the garage to get the car and went to pick up my eldest daughter, we were already late.

When we got to Shevchenko Square, we saw the tail of the convoy of cars leaving, so we drove a little bit towards Pushcha-Vodytsia and decided to turn around and go back home.

“He wouldn’t be our dad if he hadn’t joined”

– How did you decide to join the territorial defense forces?

– On February 24, I could not go anywhere because I stayed with my children. It was clear that I would not be able to stay at home for another day. My daughters used social media to keep track of where the territorial defense recruitment centers were opening. It was obvious that the authorities were ready to give out weapons. It was a very good decision. It helped Kharkiv maintain its independence, and it helped Kyiv to a great extent.

I rushed to the weapons distribution point in the school building, and they said: “No, you need to go to the center on Ovrutska Street, sign up there, and then you can get a weapon.” I went there. On Ovrutska Street, they said: “No, go back to the school.” I went to the school, and they said: “No, go to Ovrutska Street.” This was happening as the air-raid sirens were blaring, we were running around, hiding in the basement of the school. Then, I remember standing at the gate on Ovrutska Street, and there was an elderly man standing in front of me. The person letting me through asked him: “How old are you?” “I’m seventy,” the man said, and then added, “but I have combat experience, I’m ready to go to war! Why are you recruiting these children?” He was told he couldn’t join. “How old are you?” the man letting people through asked me. “I’m fifty-eight. I turned fifty-eight the day before yesterday.” “Oh, you still have time, come in,” he told me. I went in, and there were a lot of people filling out forms. I also took a sheet of paper and a pen, and at that moment we were attacked by a sabotage group, they were shooting and throwing grenades. We were ordered to go to the basement. I went down to the basement, and stood between the windows in case shrapnel flew. I stood there with a pen and paper and thought:
“And you call this ‘lucky’? They can throw a grenade in here and my fight will be over!” There was no fear, but I was so disappointed! I wanted to join the army so badly, I was so prepared, and it was so stupid to die in a basement! Then they gave me a gun, and I felt much more comfortable. Even if there is another attack by some sabotage group, at least I won’t die like cattle for slaughter, I will fight.

Then we started doing guard duty at the “Promenade” [a shopping center in Kyiv — O.O.], going on patrols. The situation was very uncertain, and unstable, with constant shelling, etc. In early March, part of our platoon was sent to “Chaika” [an airfield in the suburbs of Kyiv — O.O.]. They were shelled from an airplane there, thank God, everyone survived. Then we were sent there as well. The Chaika airfield was our first combat mission. We were waiting for the landing at Chaika. Can you imagine? We stood on the 2nd line of defense and prayed to the Armed Forces that they would hold the first line. We were being shelled from everywhere, even though we were standing on the 2nd line. At any moment, Russia’s airborne assault units could have landed, and we would have had to engage in combat… We were lucky, we had no losses. We knew that a platoon from another company of our battalion went to the Irpin forest, they were immediately attacked with mortar fire, and there were some dead and wounded. We were taught by their example how important it is to practice tactical medicine: a fellow soldier’s legs were blown off, another ran up and started checking his pulse… This is something that should not be done in such cases, you should apply a tourniquet. This is what we learned from. But we know very well that it could have been us who received this order to go into the forest, and it would be us looking for our limbs… We were aware of this and are aware of it to this day. With these examples, I am trying to convey the atmosphere of the time, and the spirit that was there. And it was incredible! The next time I felt it was only near the village of Robotyne, on the front line.

Everyone in the family knew that I would join the fight… My comrades-in-arms asked me: “How do your wife and daughters feel about your leaving?” How? They knew! The children said: “He wouldn’t be our dad if he hadn’t joined.”

“I never thought I would be waking up at night from the cold”

– Dr. Zhaloba, you, a civilian, had to quickly adapt to the military lifestyle. What caused the greatest difficulties?

– Extreme conditions require quick adaptation. However, everyday life isa separate issue. I never thought I would be waking up at night from the cold. We slept in the “Promenade” on cardboard. There was a cement floor and nothing to cover ourselves with. The clothes were also inappropriate, I was not very well-dressed. With time, we received uniforms and sleeping bags. But in the beginning, we all caught a cold, everyone was feverish. Someone had pneumonia after staying in the basement at school. It was very cold outside at that time. At one post there was a strong draft, someone had a coat, and we passed that coat to each other: we were standing there for two hours and passing it around.

During our stay at Chaika, we were given food and everything we needed. One way or another, we had some connections. While the young conscripts stationed there were cold, their hands were shaking. One of them came up to me and asked, “Do you have candy? Do you have something sweet?”. We had Snickers and other sweets. We got it out, gave it to him, and he started crying: “I’ve never liked sweets, but here,” he said, “I just want some.” And it was true, too, we ate a lot of sweets back then.

We were freezing while on duty, especially at night. I danced as much as I hadn’t danced at discos in my youth, I tried to move all the time to keep my feet warm. I remember coming back for the night: it was dark, and we weren’t allowed to turn on the light. Once I got into my sleeping bag, I had to wait for ten minutes, and then a wave of warmth and peacefulness would wash over me, and I would fall asleep.

At that time, there was incredible enthusiasm, high morale, and mutual support. Only those who were ready to defend Kyiv stayed in the city, those who could not or did not want to leave. Support was felt at every step. People were bringing each other coffee, sandwiches, hot dogs.

One day, a company commander came and said: “You have 15 minutes to get ready.” We put on our gear, took our weapons, and in 15 minutes we left for “Lavina” [a shopping center in Kyiv — O.O.]. Like at Chaika, we were expecting a helicopter assault. There was enough space in front of “Lavina,” and helicopters could actually land and disembark. There was fighting in the Irpin-Bucha direction, and there was information that they were ready to throw the troops into the rear. We took up the defense in the parking lot. We set up machine guns and grenade launchers, and practiced together how we would act, and who would shoot what. We were very glad that the Armed Forces of Ukraine were standing on the ground floor with their equipment and tanks. We were also happy because, although we slept in the corridor, on the floor of “Lavina,” there were many restrooms with warm water and liquid soap. You put your hand — and soap flows, and you put your hand — and warm water flows. At least we could wash up there. Before that, we were in a room with underfloor heating, but just 2 restrooms for 60 people.

On the second or third night, I had to replace my comrade at the position, he was running late, and I was nervous. At that time, the Russians started shelling us with rockets. One hit where the guys were sleeping, the second one hit where we were standing at the position, crashed into an oak tree, and the third one fell where we were supposed to exit. That is, if my comrade had not been late, we would have been directly hit by rockets. None of our men were hurt or even wounded, but one civilian was killed, a security guard. The fire safety system was triggered and we got wet, our clothes got wet too. Everyone immediately went to their positions because we expected an attack after the shelling. We came out wet and very cold. When the Russians retreated, we were transferred to a school in Nyvky [near the Nyvky metro station — O.O.]. There, more or less systematic training began.

– Dr. Zhaloba, how long had the period of your involvement with the territorial defense forces lasted?

– It is still ongoing. We were relocated from Nyvky and transferred to Kaniv. There we received training at the level of a brigade, battalion, and so on. There we learned how to dig trenches, went shooting, and passed the tests. I was second in the platoon for accuracy and speed of shooting. The guys even asked: “Have you been shooting before? Did you take any courses?” But no, I had no prior training.

During these trainings, I developed pneumonia and was hospitalized in the summer, in August. It all ended with me having a double surgery on September 13, 2022, and then recovering.

During this time, my comrades-in-arms fought to Bakhmut, suffered their first losses and had their first real infantry combat experience. They had a close battle in the trenches with the Russians, the Wagner mercenaries. It was then that we learned what it was like when your comrades died. It is impossible to get used to it. But I was not with them then.

Because we had the experience of serving in the territorial defense, and the guys had some skills, we started playing around with drones. Our company commander supported our initiatives. That’s how a group of guys emerged who, under the leadership of the “Pilot,”⁵ started working with drones. This is the unit I am fighting in!

“Mutual help and support is the foundation of everything!”

– Please tell us more about your unit, what does it do?

– I serve⁶ in a battalion of unmanned aerial systems, in a company and a platoon that specializes in this. We were trained in several specialized centers. In July, we went to the front. From July 16, 2023, I was at the front near the village of Robotyne, Zaporizhzhia region. We stayed there until late September. You know, the feeling of fraternity was and is incredible. It was then that I saw all the destruction in person, for example, the destroyed town of Orikhiv. We were stationed in the village of Mala Tokmachka. The tankers with whom we were there later reported that there were no houses left in Mala Tokmachka. The absurdity of war!

I remember one day we were going to our positions, walking along the road, and the sappers were working there. The fields around were overgrown with tall weeds. “How are you working in these conditions?” I asked one of the officers. And he said: “We have to demine, we have to clean it up. Actually, we should be working with grapnel, throwing and pulling them up, but we don’t have time, so we’re working with our hands.” Their standard, relatively speaking, is 100 mines, and they have already cleared 300 mines. There have already been wounded who exploded on mines while working. My brother-in-arms said: “Forget about it! Why are you risking so much because of a stupid order?” “No,” he said, “we are working without orders, on our own initiative, we have to help the guys.” It was summer, the road was narrow. It was clear that if it rained, the vehicles would not be able to get through, so we had to clear the mines to make the road wider.

Once, we were returning from our positions in bad weather, I was driving, and we ended up in this minefield in the mud. The guys were tense: “Father, calm down, calm down, we believe in you, you will get us there, no rush.” Our comrades thought something had happened to us, they went to meet us, worried about us. Mutual help and support is the foundation of everything! I have felt, seen, and experienced a lot during this time, but I have no regrets.

I used to tell my students that I realized that I was a drop in the ocean, just a drop, but at the same time part of a big, powerful stream. I am proud to be a historian who has written about the accomplishments of the past, and now I am part of the historical process. Each of us who says that we understand our modest role is sincere. We have seen what other guys have done during this time. We emphasize this so that we are not confused with those who boast at every turn about what kind of soldiers they are and post photos on social media. This should not happen. I would not want to be perceived as a Facebook warrior. This is a very important point. There are different realities at the front, and there is incredible mutual support there. One day I was returning by car, picking up some infantrymen on the way — the dust was stuck in my eyes, they were burning… I told my children and everyone later: “Every Ukrainian somehow tries to thank everyone who fought. But in front of an infantryman who fought, stormed and held a trench, we just have to kneel down and silently bow our heads.” What these men endured, what they went through, simply cannot be compared to everything I have experienced during this time. I realize this. I’m 60 now, I don’t need any fame. What I have today is enough for me. Others found themselves in different circumstances and had to sacrifice themselves, for which they are greatly respected. But I am aware that under the right conditions, I am ready to do the same.

“All right, ‘Father’ it is.”

– Dr. Zhaloba, how did you get your call sign?

– They wanted to give me the call sign “Professor.” The first company commander always called me “Professor” because it was unusual for him that a real professor with knowledge of a foreign language volunteered. When we started discussing call signs, he said: “Well, Professor?”. I said: “I don’t want to be perceived as a professor, I’m a soldier now, I’m tired, and I’ve never boasted about being a professor.” Even before, when, during small talk, acquaintances asked me where I worked, I used to say that I was a teacher at school. I am a teacher, I teach, that’s all. It has never been an end in itself for me to get all these titles. I’m proud to have earned them in time, I don’t intend to give them up, but it doesn’t mean that this is my main achievement in life. So I suggested: “No, let’s go with Krokva”. I’m from the village of Krokva, a very small village that doesn’t even have a village council. I know that my fellow villagers are very proud to have a doctor, a full professor from their village. The guys say: “No, we won’t remember that, it won’t work.” At the same time, everyone started calling me “Batia,” or “father” because I was the oldest. I told them: “Please just don’t call me ‘Batia!’ I can’t stand all these Russian narratives and songs about ‘Batya the Combatant,’ so you’re going to call me Batia?” And my comrades supported me: “No, we will call ‘Father.’ Okay?” they suggested. “All right, ‘Father’ it is,” I said. And so the call-sign stuck.

“We need people like you to re-energize public opinion and attract attention”

– Dr. Zhaloba, I know that you are also fighting in the information space, particularly abroad. Please tell us about this aspect of your work.

– In February 2023, I received an invitation from my pan-European friends. They decided to organize an information trip to mark the anniversary of the Russian attack. I joined them, did an information tour, and gave interviews. With tears in their eyes, Ukrainians, children, came up to me and thanked me, but I felt very uncomfortable. They looked at me with admiration and, accordingly, as if they were waiting for confirmation that they would return. At such moments, you realize what responsibility you have. A child from Donetsk approached me: “I want to return to Ukrainian Donetsk.” She is 16 years old and has been deprived of her hometown for half her life!

In November 2023, I received a new invitation. The need for a foreign trip was justified by the fact that after October 7, Ukraine was not only in 2nd place but in 4th or 5th place in the information space. “We need people like you to re-energize public opinion and attract attention,” my colleagues told me. At that time, I used my leave to travel to Germany and Austria. I don’t regret it, because I had meetings in the Austrian parliament, and all this was covered by the media.

– Could you please tell us what was the main message you were traveling with? What did you talk about?

– My main message was “Our war is your war” and “Get rid of illusions, come back to reality!”. I tried to explain to the Europeans that by supporting us, they are supporting themselves, ensuring their further peaceful existence and well-being. It is no longer possible to do nothing and leave everything as it was, it is an illusion.

When my friends and colleagues invited me for the first time, they did not expect me to come in uniform. During this visit, I was asked to attend one of the events wearing civilian clothes. They asked me: “Don’t you have any civilian clothes with you?” I said: “No. I’m on a work trip, so I’m wearing my work uniform, first of all, and secondly, it’s my internal manifesto, because I am a soldier of the Armed Forces of Ukraine today.”

During my second trip, a young girl came up to me at the train station in Hanover and said: “Are you from Ukraine?”. I said: “Yes, why?” And as she reached to greet me, she burst into tears. “It’s okay,” I said, “it’s okay.” “I wanted to thank you,” she said, crying on my shoulder. She could barely speak, she was crying, crying, crying, and couldn’t calm down. And this is also an indicator; it’s also our mission to keep our spirits up.

“This is a war between democracy and dictatorship, between light and darkness, and I want light.”

– Dr. Zhaloba, how will the war unfold, in your opinion?

– For me, this is a civilizational war that raises the question of whether Europe will survive as a player and, accordingly, whether the principles and values on which it was built will survive. They are under threat both within these countries and from outside. Because of their political correctness, Western Europeans have been silent about some of the problems they had and still have. Many of my foreign colleagues say that they feel freer in Ukraine than in Europe, where they have built a lot of red lines that they are afraid to cross, but which are already hurting them today. If they want their children to have a decent future, they need to understand what is happening in Ukraine and why it is in their interest to support Ukraine.

I am deeply convinced that Ukraine can and should become a platform where new efficiency of the state organism and state institutions is minted. Ukraine should become an example for other countries. Including Western European countries.

For example, I am proud of our Diia program, which has no analogs. For example, I once asked my eldest daughter: “I need a certificate of residence for my pension certificate,” and with a few taps, Diia issued me the certificate. Can we do this? Yes, we can! Can this be an example for others? Yes!

This is a war between democracy and dictatorship, between light and darkness, and I want light. I want it for myself and for my children. I will fight to the last for the light to win. And today we are on the side of light — we are warriors of light, there is no escaping it. 

– Dr. Zhaloba, thank you very much for the interview.

Interviewed by Oksana Ovsiiuk

The publication uses photographs from the private archive of Ihor Zhaloba.

This publication is also available in Ukrainian.